The Argument

The New York Times Opinion

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The other side is dangerously wrong. They think you are too. But for democracy to work, we need to hear each other out. Each week New York Times Opinion columnists David Leonhardt, Michelle Goldberg and Ross Douthat explain the arguments from across ...Show More

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Which 2020 Underdogs Stand a Chance? (LIVE from NYC)

35:26 | Apr 17th

What should U.S. immigration policy look like? The columnists debate Kirstjen Nielsen's resignation, Trump's xenophobia and Obama's legacy on immigration live on stage at the Times Center in New York. Then, in response to listener voicemail, Ross, Mi...Show More

Should Weed Be Legal?

37:13 | Dec 20th, 2018

Has "big cannabis" downplayed the dangers of legalization? Michelle Goldberg debates author Alex Berenson, whose forthcoming book makes the case against marijuana. Then, David Leonhardt, Ross Douthat and Michelle argue about which pot policy the Unit...Show More

Should Biden Run?

35:43 | Apr 4th

Is Joe Biden the Democrats’ best hope to beat Trump in 2020? Or is he woefully behind the times? Ross Douthat, Michelle Goldberg and David Leonhardt disagree about the former vice president's potential run for POTUS. Then the columnists debate what A...Show More

Who Botched the Mueller Report?

35:19 | Mar 28th

Special Counsel Robert Mueller's investigation into the Trump campaign's ties to Russia has wrapped, and Attorney General William Barr's letter to Congress has been delivered. Michelle, Ross and David debate whether there really was "no collusion," i...Show More

Is Trump Causing White Terrorism?

36:45 | Mar 21st

Is President Trump’s rhetoric partly to blame for New Zealand’s white-supremacist mosque shooting?Jamelle Bouie joins hosts Ross Douthat, Michelle Goldberg and David Leonhardt for a debate about xenophobic ideology, internet troll culture and their c...Show More

One-on-One With Elizabeth Warren

49:35 | Mar 13th

Senator Elizabeth Warren sits down with David Leonhardt for a chat about her 2020 presidential campaign. They talk Donald Trump, her proposed wealth tax and universal childcare program, antitrust policy and her dog Bailey. Then, Ross Douthat and Mich...Show More

How Does the Catholic Church Redeem Itself?

32:30 | Mar 7th

Is prekindergarten for all a liberal pipe dream? The columnists sit down with special guest Mara Gay of The Times editorial board to discuss the successes and pitfalls of New York City's universal pre-K program. Then, Ross Douthat and New York magazi...Show More

Will Michael Cohen's Testimony Doom Trump?

36:01 | Feb 28th

Was there anything in Michael Cohen's congressional testimony on Wednesday that could actually threaten Donald Trump's presidency? Michelle Goldberg and David Leonhardt break it down. Later Ross Douthat joins them for a debate over whether Bernie San...Show More

Is Trump the Real National Emergency?

36:23 | Feb 21st

From bypassing Congress to try to fund a wall on the U.S.-Mexico border, to accusing administration officials of treason, is Donald Trump America’s national emergency? Michelle sees authoritarianism while Ross thinks the real threat to American democ...Show More

Is the Green New Deal a Leftist Fantasy?

39:06 | Feb 14th

Is the Green New Deal a symbol of the future of the Democratic Party, or is it just socialism disguised as climate reform? Ross Douthat and Michelle Goldberg are joined by Times editorial board member Michelle Cottle to debate the new initiative and ...Show More

The Abortion Argument

45:21 | Feb 7th

This is not your typical argument about abortion. Ross Douthat and Michelle Goldberg debate women's reproductive health this week and while it's no surprise that they disagree, they manage to hear each other out. Then Medicare Rights Center founder D...Show More

Who's Leading the Democratic Primary?

36:56 | Jan 31st

Democrats are throwing their hats in the ring for the 2020 presidential election, but who has a real shot? Opinion's new columnist, Jamelle Bouie, joins Michelle Goldberg and Ross Douthat to weigh in on who has an edge, whose campaign needs sharpenin...Show More

Have Republicans Betrayed the Working Class?

40:24 | Jan 24th

Is anti-Zionism just another form of anti-Semitism? Michelle and special guest Bret Stephens debate liberal critiques of Israel and the future of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Then, is Tucker Carlson really a populist? Bret and Ross discuss what ...Show More

How Trump Loses the G.O.P.

35:32 | Jan 17th

An ongoing government shutdown. More Russia revelations. Ross, David and Michelle agree there’s a point at which Republicans could turn on Trump. But what will it take? Then, the columnists debate anti-Semitism on the left and the controversies roili...Show More

Why Do Powerful Women Make America Panic?

36:33 | Jan 10th

The government shutdown continues as Trump and the Democrats battle over the border wall. Who is winning? Which side makes the stronger immigration argument? Ross Douthat, Michelle Goldberg and David Leonhardt debate. Later, they discuss why America ...Show More

Your Questions, Answered

37:36 | Jan 3rd

Our listeners asked: what will be the negative consequences of social media on kids? How can we solve income inequality in America? Which Democrat has the best chance of beating Trump in 2020? Ross Douthat, Michelle Goldberg and David Leonhardt answe...Show More

Will Trump's Presidency Survive 2019?

35:11 | Dec 13th, 2018

Trump's mounting legal problems have the columnists wondering if he'll finish his first term. Michelle Goldberg visualizes President Pelosi. Editorial board member Mara Gay makes Ross Douthat answer for his WASP nostalgia. And David Leonhardt recomme...Show More

Is Donald Trump A Traitor?

35:36 | Dec 6th, 2018

Trump's Russia entanglement has the columnists asking, "Is the president a traitor?" Ross Douthat sits down with Lawfare's executive editor Susan Hennessey to lay out what's happening with Robert Mueller's special counsel investigation. Later, Ross r...Show More

What Do We Do About Climate Change?

34:13 | Nov 29th, 2018

How can climate change be solved if politicians can't even agree there's a problem? The columnists brainstorm. Then, David Leonhardt visits Capitol Hill to interview California Representative Ro Khanna, "the ambassador of Silicon Valley," about Trump...Show More

Do We Need A Third Party?

33:59 | Nov 21st, 2018

A listener's voicemail asks the columnists, does America need a third party? Then, just in time for Thanksgiving, our argumentative trio dishes out some advice for how to handle your own dinner-table debates. And finally, a Coen brothers recommendati...Show More

Is Amazon Bad for America?

38:42 | Nov 15th, 2018

After Amazon announced its uninspired new headquarters locations, the columnists are surprised to find they agree on the danger of the website's monopoly, for different reasons. David Leonhardt is baited into playing the "neo-liberal shill." Ross Dou...Show More

Did Trump Lose The Midterms?

38:01 | Nov 8th, 2018

What do the Democratic gains in the House and Republican gains in the Senate mean for the country’s future? Ross Douthat dreams of a fantastic world of rainbows, child tax credits and a better president. David Leonhardt wishes racism was more decisiv...Show More

Who's to Blame for American Political Violence?

33:56 | Nov 1st, 2018

Do Republicans have an anger problem? The columnists debate whether Trump incited the recent targeted attacks. After Michelle Goldberg reports back from the campaign trail in Georgia, they all discuss the partisan battle of the sexes: has politics be...Show More

How Screwed Up Is American Democracy?

31:56 | Oct 25th, 2018

How rotten has our democratic system has become, the columnists wonder, and what could fix it? David Leonhardt is furious about voter suppression in North Dakota and Georgia. Ross Douthat thinks NeverTrump Republicans should cast their midterm votes ...Show More

Is Trump Destroying the World Order?

31:27 | Oct 18th, 2018

With the killing of journalist Jamal Khashoggi, David Leonhardt asks guest Thomas Friedman about the strained future of U.S.-Saudi relations. Then, Michelle Goldberg, Ross Douthat and David debate whether Trump's foreign policy emboldens autocrats an...Show More

Is the Supreme Court Broken?

30:03 | Oct 11th, 2018

Did Brett Kavanaugh’s confirmation break the Supreme Court? Michelle Goldberg feels the patriarchy’s boot on her neck. David Leonhardt cautions Democrats about running on the #MeToo movement in the midterms. And Ross Douthat sings. Seriously. For ba...Show More

Introducing The Argument, an Opinion podcast from The New York Times

01:37 | Oct 4th, 2018

Coming Thursday, October 11, a new Opinion podcast from The New York Times that answers the question, "How could they possibly think that?" Join Opinion columnists David Leonhardt, Michelle Goldberg and Ross Douthat every Thursday as they explain the...Show More